What is with the Democratic party anyway? We need to raise taxes to fund everything including Social Security. We dipped into those payments not because our Social Security system was robust but because Democrats wanted to put more money back into the economy. Now they want to renew this.

The Republicans, of course, are against it even though they hate taxes?

Can't we get a cohesive strategy out of either party instead of a "if you are for it, I'm agin it"? Are you for debt reduction or against it?

Social Security is a debt. Listen up both parties: we need to decrease the debt. To keep kicking our debts down the road is what got us in this fix.

The economy still needs stimulus. The problem is that tax cuts are obviously an ineffective form of stimulus. Unemployed people can't make their house payments from tax cuts.

The SS trust fund is the largest single piece of our debt. Either the trust fund is a worthless IOU, OR we have a big debt problem. Both can't be true.

I'M JUST SAYIN'
Another way to look at the Debt Ceiling

Let's say you come home from work and find there has been a
sewer backup in your home and you have sewage up to your ceiling.

What do you think you should do, raise the ceiling,
or pump out the crap?

Your choice in 2012.

There are huge piles of shit in government, stacked to the ceiling. A gigantic black slimy greasy piece of shit Occupies our White House. Let's focus on Barack Obama.

You're right. We can't keep kicking the debt down the road. Your generation, Lumberjacks generation, Stash's generation, did that.

Now my generation, my children's and their children's will be faced with the consequences. Hopefully we'll have the fortitude to do what's right: put our senile elderly in convalescent homes and make the necessary tough decisions.

Not trying to be a dick here, but your generations really fucked our Nation up. We cannot and will not be taxed for the size and scope of government that you guys allowed to corrupt this Nation.

Pray you that my generation creates enough wealth to pay for your peaceful passing's and then the wisdom to sever the gangrenous limb.

Your generation is going to do just what my generation did. You are going along for the ride...as a passenger with very, very little input. You are foolish if you think otherwise.

Do you think any of us are in control? Politics is BS. Money is power and every economic policy that really counts was purchased by special interests. It was true during my lifetime and you, who somehow think you and your generation are significant, cannot do squat about it and will participate in the same system of choosing the best of two bad choices in elections. And nothing will change.

You will pay and pay. I will pay and pay. The ones with the real money will skate.



The game has been played so that the nations go broke but the rich are immune. The world has seen instances of this before but we are going into a grand mall of collapses. The method of getting out of this mess in the past has been change of government (not elections). That is unlikely to happen anymore but who knows.

If it is only happiness you care about I have some good news. Money is not necessary for happiness. I live most of the year in a country that has three or four generations living under one roof. They are happy with their tortillas and beans. The old are respected, the young are revered. They get by just as you will. They laugh a lot.

Pessimist much? But this demonstrates a scarier part of the equation than just Lumbersocialist telling us we need to spend ourselves out of debt. The depressed generation trying to convince everyone that there is "No Hope". Continue to believe so BB, I personally won't sit back and watch the US become another Argentina and do nothing. You may feel helpless and lacking control/influence, I don't.


We should tuck and roll, push the reset button, play a different game or run a different race. Laughter is an expression of happiness. Eating refried beans in a shanty in the middle of the Mexican dessert farting to stay warm and laughing at the sounds doesn't sound like a "fun" time to me. But, to each their own. History has also proven that the "1%" doesn't get to control who joins the club. I'll be there. You can kick it with the 99% if it makes you happy.

You may do something but you won't accomplish anything. I am in total agreement that we cannot spend our way out of this if, by saying spend your way, you are talking about public jobs that produce nothing. We need to spend, though. Education, infrastructure.. we need to spend like crazy.



If you are not one of the .1% what are you going to do? Your one vote? A snipers rifle? Manufacture suicide vests and recruit volunteers?

There is a slight chance that a movement like OWS on steroids might work, a little bit. You are against that though.

The time for spending is over. Umteen trillion in debt the time for investing in our intellectual and physical infrastructure is LONG past. Because your generation was "punch drunk" on easy money and went on a spending spree is inexcusable. Do you Like how my generation gets to do that; blame you. Yep, your fault, Lumberdicks fault, Stash's fault and so on. Will I pass the buck or kick the can to my kinder? Not if I can help it. Not if I can convince the OWS r-words (the r-word is the one Stash hates) that they protest the wrong people.

The TEA-Party had it right. Protest Government. OWS is failed to doom because the money lenders will control government and protect their assets. We need People of Courage, Truth, Honor, Fidelity, Hospitality, Discipline, Industriousness, Self-Reliance, Perseverance in government. Unfortunately this keeps people like the ones that argue on this board, but few, from being viable candidates. Sure I disrespect most here by saying it but, a constitutional conservative government is what we were given and those since have raped it's existence. Hence the Federal Reserve is allowed to enslave us; the 14th amendment has been skull fucked to extend free bus rides to unique and special snowflakes to tax funded "schools"; And the demoncrat party big government movement has extended "peace officer" police state status to college campus security;
Absolutely Loooooooooove your decimal point placement. It goes cuuuuuuuuuuuuuuute with your new depression-ism age.

However the new fight now is to get "Constitution Suicide Bombers" into government. We have a considerable amount of people elected already. With this last debt ceiling debate they held firm.

Go in. Ascertain Objectives. Pull Cord.
Get elected. Focus on unconstitutional (ABC) programs. Eliminate from budget.

2012 will be a pinnacle election year.

If you are speaking of your generation making a difference, your generations part of the vote is not really very big. Ditto on membership in the teaparty.

The decimal point was acknowledging an article stating that the 1% that controls things is really .1%.



It will. By all rights the party in power that accomplished nothing should be ousted. This year I am not sure.

I think you are being short sighted on this. Think it through. I have no idea how all the world's financial problems are going to work out but in the end they do work out. Slate sorta wiped clean we start over again.

Competition wise we are back to nation vs. nation for wealth.

The country who has the best educated children that innovate and invent is in the best position. The country that can move finished goods the cheapest has an advantage in trade.

I have been in countries with dirt roads only. Groceries are expensive when they have to be flown in. They are forever stuck in third world status.

Our existing roads are going to crumble. If you think of your road like a roof on a house you kind of get an understanding of what is going to happen. The damage from the 'weather' makes the cost of maintaining the roads seem cheap. The subgrade underneath them eventually fails. If you need an example look no further than Ocean Shores who had to rebuild all their roads.

Besides education and infrastructure there are other important things to maintain and get better on but these are my big two.

care to elaborate?
Except that the cards will still be stacked in favor of the rich. Unless your speaking of "Global Bankruptcy" and then the only loss to the rich/creditors is minor. They've been living off our interest payments. Most have likely seen a return in their investments so far in lending nations monies.

I couldn't think of a better way to have it.

And this is where we are fucked. Look at your OWS campus idiots and POLL their degree choices; underwater basket weaving, "Director" (iKayaks YouTube from another thread.), environmentalists(tree huggers), the list is endless with worthless degrees these morons are getting and NOT finding the jobs for. Go figure.

Like I said before. The time to spend on Education and infrastructure is PAST. We don't have the money. We have the debt of borrowing money for an all week kegger in kancun. Did you even listen to the last debt ceiling debate. It was over an INTEREST payment. And then raising the borrowing credit capacity and that is being spent on bullshit now.

Two parent to children house. Dad's laid off, Mom's income barely pays the bills and the interest on the credit cards. House is falling apart and the kids are getting ready to go back to school. UNLIKE this senario the US doesn't have the assets to sell off at a reduced rate from the drunken spending spree we went on. And NOW the spoiled fucking brats and protesting that the rich men aren't giving them Awesome Sauce jobs and mommy and daddy can't get more of a loan.

Republicans are at fault
Democrats are at fault


I've been to Kentucky once as well, unfortunately. What's your point?


Great. Where are you going to get the money from? I don't support taxing the rich more. I support taxing everyone (Even the poor) at a low EQUAL rate. (Funny how equal protection is only paid attention to by Stash and Lumbermoron until it come to Equally taxing everyone.) They benefit just as much from paved roads as I do.


Neither of these should be or started out being federally Constituted responsibilities. They should be removed from the federal budget. Yeah, let the States take care of that.


My solution. Fuck the interest payment our AAA is bye bye anyways. Fuck paying the principle on the loan. Let federal workers go by dissolving as many ABC agencies as possible from lack of funding. But this will take kicking out as many R's and D's as possible and finding 3rd party candidates that have no allegiance to the Dept. of War or the Social Agencies.